#Its4U - The antidote to Cop28 with Dr. David Ko and Richard Busellato

Welcome to 12 days of Cop, where I’ll be interviewing inspiring people who are reminding us where to put our focus during these next two weeks. Kicking off with the brains and hearts behind #Its4U Dr. David Ko and Richard Busellato, we dig into what Its4U is all about, and encourage everyone to get involved! 

You can sign up to Its4U at bit.ly/signup2its4U 

Join the Facebook Group https://www.facebook.com/groups/1017721559112354 

Use the hashtag #Its4U when sharing the beauty of life, the dignity of all living beings, or how you are supporting local businesses to help your community thrive. 

Join us over the next two weeks for 12 days of Cop and find some inspiration from these amazing people. 

#Its4U #ClimateCourage #UncommonCourage 

To get in touch with me, all of my contact details are here https://linktr.ee/andreatedwards

My book Uncommon Courage, an invitation, is here https://mybook.to/UncommonCourage

My book 18 Steps to an All-Star LinkedIn Profile, is here https://mybook.to/18stepstoanallstar

Transcript

0:11

Welcome. My name is Andrea Edwards. And for the next 2 weeks, I'm gonna introduce you to a group of incredibly inspiring people, so check-in every day. And we are gonna be having conversations which we're calling the 12 days of COP. Now this is not my idea. I'm just your host. The brain and heart behind this are joining me today, and I'm very, very delighted to welcome Richard Bussalatto And doctor David Cove, welcome. Good to see you both. Thank you. Great to be here. Thank you. Thank you. Now some people have already met you through me. But for those who haven't, do you wanna both just give a quick introduction and as well talk about your book as well? Because, Your book is amazing. Who wants to go 1st? Richard, do you wanna go 1st? I'm happy to kick us off. Although I'm probably neither the heart Know the brain behind this operation because, you know, he's next to me. I grew up in Sweden, via Brussels and a few other places back and forth, I ended up in London about 27, 28 years ago. I've been working in finance all my career. I've been managing capital for hedge funds, banks, industrial companies, always with the same scope which is basically To deliver high quality returns for my investors, and those investors tend to be pension funds, various insurance companies, sovereign wealth funds, and individuals to various savings pools. So that's my background and how I ended up Very much in this space is that perspective of of risks and what we are actually facing going forward with regard to our savings and our Overall lifestyle. And I think for the first time in my career, which spans, you know, 5 decades working in markets and over 30 years of managing capital, this is the first time I've encountered an issue That you cannot sidestep or get away from because we're all inhabiting the same space, which is this planet. And previous crisis, there was always a possibility that you could say, I'm I'm I'm I'm taking in myself out left field. You can't do that here. You are involved whether you like it or not and therefore it's gonna be imperative that we deal with this As quickly, as swiftly, and to the best of our ability as soon as possible. And I'll pass it Over to David Happily who can talk us through our book. I met David about 6 years ago. And, thank you. Thank you, Richard. Thank you, Andrea, for having us here again. It's indeed a real pleasure. Every time we have conversations, I learned something new. I it's always thought provoking. And, you know, you're one of the people one of the few people we've met who has such a broad kind of reach into what's going on around the world and is able to bring it all together. And and then to have a conversation about it in a way that everybody can feel comfortable expressing how they feel without any sense of theory or might I be saying the wrong thing here or any of that. So that's just remarkable. So thank you. Thank you. Oh, no. I appreciate that. I really do. And and and and, Richard, you know, let let me show you this. Oops. Cameras. And which way they go? That's that's the book. The green screen is, trying to devour it, which might not be a bad thing to do. But, anyway, the title is the unsustainable truth. And, you know, Richard is too modest. I think when people talk about him and me, and they they ask me, You know, how much of this is me? How much of this is Richard? And I I I have always have just one answer. Richard is one of those people that just mix whatever it is that you do better. So so that that's that's really, you know, the the icing that goes on top, the thing that really makes makes it Palatable to everybody or indeed actually very attractive and all of those that seem along there. So without it, what we are trying to do here with It's For You And the book and so on is not there. But just a very quick quick word about the book. We've been working as investment managers for 30 years. So that's a considerable amount of time considering, the amount of crisis and periods we have seen. And in those times, we have had both the situations where we've been in the middle of it. In, my my first job, I was since I was Really part of a group that blew the world up literally, basically, from from the financial crisis sense. It was during 98 At a time when the Russian government defaulted, and it led to a cascade of events all about the fact that we have overreached without realizing we have overreach. And that's one common theme to all the things. And in 2007, as we were heading into great financial crisis, As Rich is talking about sidestepping, I stepped out of financial industry because I saw that the same picture was playing out, and I didn't need to be in that movie again. I joined it back in the depth of the European debt crisis. This was when Greece was blowing up, and Germany didn't know where they had a lake to stand on, and didn't know what to do, and Italy was praying. Not me. Not me. In that way. And I was step back into it together with a friend, And we raised a huge amount of money because people saw us as the people who understood risk, understood when to step in front of it, Understood when to step aside. And in 2017, when Richard and I got together, we started looking into sustainable investing. And after 5 years looking deeply into it, we left the industry, because we realized what we are facing ahead From that world of the financial system that we are, and the money that we have after we work hard, and Richard is the first to admit he wants to keep the money he's worked hard, As as all of us do, we do not see a way that is going to get us out of it without helping the other person first. And this is a very odd situation where you find that, actually, you are actually together because there is only 1 planet that we are here. And if we are going to step past this in whichever form, we have to come together first. And that's what the program is for you is about. That's why we call it the antidote to COP 28 in many regards because it's not someone doing something. It's us Doing it for ourselves. So thank you, Andrea. No, no, that's that's great. So I don't, I think it's important that everyone understands both of your backgrounds because You're very serious business people, and as Richard say, he loves capitalism. You know? So you're not coming at it from a naive point point of view or, You know, because I I have conversations with people, and I'm I'm like, I'd it's so much more complicated than that. And reading your book for me was It was so fantastic just for that big picture understanding of how the financial services industry, how it it all connects, especially with the pension side as well. So I found it incredibly like, if you wanna understand the climate crisis, you've also got to understand the global economy. I think they're 2 things that need to go together. So, But we're here to talk about It's For You, and, I'd love to just let's let's talk tell tell everyone what it is and why they need to get involved. Okay. Richard, should I take this Yeah. Yeah. You you hit it. Yeah. You do it much better than I do. So please Tell us why we're actually doing this over 12 days of COP in the run up to Christmas and why we think it's Incredibly important that all of us do our bit because it's the only way we can actually battle this. So so the start of it, comes from this aspect where we recognize climate is a thing. The climate devastations is a thing, and pretty much everybody around the world recognize that. The part where we come to is that collectively, Our spending is what drives everything around. Literally, where you buy your tomatoes from. And it's it's it's basically an understanding on that. And whilst the governments are trying to talk about what regulations we can put in place and what everything else does, if we are not aware ourselves Of that simple fact, it is ultimately our collective spending. That's what all the money that's going around this. Then we're gonna miss the point that we have that genuine power. So over those 12 days, what we want what we're calling on you to do is to redirect your spending to those you think are making the world better. It's literally who you buy your tomatoes from. There's nothing nothing more fancy than that. But to appreciate that, There are 3 things which becomes very necessary, and it's for you as a program to try and bring those 3 things about. The first is you. How do you connect yourself with nature and dignity? Because when you because our lives at the moment are so busy as we talk in our book. There was a trip my son went on a taxi where the taxi driver and him were talking. And in the end, the driver said, you know, I think they keep our lives so busy so we just don't have time to think just so that we can keep us from thinking. And and there's that element, so having that moment to be able to reconnect. And so we have programs, activities, which we want to engage people with on that. So the 2nd point is simply understanding a little bit more having those conversations about What does making the world better mean? And we had a, a segment of our show we recorded this morning. It's called who's tipping over the tipping point? And it's about, you know, keeping the world laughing sustainably. And we have this part there where there's an oil platform. And obviously, all platforms, we, you know, we do need oil. But what was happening was it was being form. He was changing his name from hummingbird to excalibur. And the reason he was changing his name was because they were having a wind farm built in order to provide electricity so that we can pump the oil up with renewable electricity. And you do have to ask yourself, If I support renewable electricity, am I supporting it to pump more oil out? Or do I think it would be better just to pop you know, pipe that electricity directly to my home, and avoid that oil along the way, and use it to displace it. So those are part of the things about what does making the world better actually mean. And the final part is the part where Richard and I come from, because what drives how these things are used ultimately is what happens to the money we spend. So that's where we we come in along the way to try and provide the the kind of conversations that can help people understand What actually happens to the money we spend? Why does it end up going that way? And and altogether, it goes back down to the thing we We're calling on people to do, which is very simply redirect your money to those you think are making the world better, And literally, that's who you buy your tomatoes from. Yeah. I like that. Now you you mentioned dignity. So can we just elaborate on that? Because I talk about dignity a lot, You know, just from a refugee, displaced persons, you know, treating people with dignity. But how how are you how are you referring to it here? It's a it's a very subtle kind of concept in a way. When we face the devastations from climate, We end up feeling ourselves very often as the victims, and we're very often feeling ourselves that we are in a situation where we want to find someone else who can help us along in that way. But the essence of coming together is to come together very much as, Equal as people who all have a voice. And dignity is to be able to know that your thoughts Matter. Your voice matters and to be able to hold ourselves and others in that way. Because if we don't think that's the case, if we think that only the right voice is better, however, we think those right voices are, Then we are not actually going to manage to go across this challenge ahead. But we are able to come together where all our voices are recognized to be to have the validity in the spaces they have. And then with that would caught that would trigger us to try and understand better Why those voices come about in that way? And in that way, what we will find is we can cut through all the vested interest That is blocking the transition, the move across. And most importantly, what it does is it allows all of us to come together and turn the challenges into opportunities that we can face ahead. And and and and the essence of what allows us to do that is that sense we have of ourselves. So dignity start from the sense of being able to identify having an identity for ourselves. This morning I was speaking with a, lady in Kenya and she she had been working on, the, female genital mutilation, trying to bring about equality in those ways. And she was saying, well, she's raising all those education and all of those things. She realized that young girls were still being effectively sold off to be wives in in that way because they live in semi arid area. The conditions were getting more stream. They weren't able to do that. And then she recognized that, actually, you know what? We can grow our own livelihoods as a group, And then they started doing that, and that gave them the ability to empower themselves. And what that did is a gift on their voice. Yep. And and that's the dignity that you get. And it's not a dignity that comes from from from my treating yourself as a victim comes from actually recognizing that you stand tall no matter the situation. And what you then said is when you take that attitude along, you see resources when nobody saw resources before. I just read a fantastic piece on, female farmers in India Where they, the males have gone off to the cities to look for work, and the women have come together. And they're not actually recognized as farmers. They don't typically have The mobile phones, the men have them, and they obviously don't have funding. But they've come together, and they're they're basically taking all the all the fertilizer and pesticides out, and they're They've gone natural, and they're growing different sorts of crops. And they're because they're becoming more and more successful, and they're coming together, and that was something you said about the coming together. But, you know, one of the things that everyone there's a bit of a pushback on the individual contribution having an effect. Right. And so it goes back to Edelman, set it up as a PR sort of thing for an oil company. I can't remember which one. But I always say to people, there's 3,800,000,000 middle class people, which is expected to grow to 4,800,000,000 by 2030. I don't know how that's possible seeing what we're seeing in the environment, the escalation we're seeing, but There's a very, very large percentage of people who are sitting in this space who who are spending money and contributing to the problem, Whether it's how they invest or how they where they buy their tomatoes from. But so I just wanted to, you know can you guys Can you give people confidence that if I change, it's gonna actually make a difference? Can you can you help people see that that's everything? You know? So all coming together and doing it. Well, actually, it's it's it's a game. It's it's 2 things that it comes about in 2 different levels. And this is where Richard and I come along. We talk of this thing called transformation ownership, which is when we Change the ownership of oil and gas and co. And if you think about doing that, you think we can't do it. It's impossible. You know? This got to be government's got to be those things. But, ultimately, these are companies. And, ultimately, just think about your government and the particular politics you happen to be in. You really want something like oil and gas and coal to be in charge of that sort of fickleness that there is? And so, actually, when you when you go through that thinking, what you really need them to be recognized is that they are global commerce much like our oceans and our air in that way. So the ownership needs to be transformed. To do that the question that you constantly face is As a gentleman spoke, who he he's very active in regenerating the rainforest, and he said we literally eat oil. It's not true that we don't and we can't because they provide the food. They provide the transport. They provide all the things that we need in that way. So how can you actually go about thinking transforming something like that if we, in our only two way, unable to say to ourselves, I can do without it. I can see how I can have a livelihood without it. So even beside the point of whether Your action is going to have the ripple effects of everyone else and so on. For you to be able to say yes I can do that, that's how you influence another person And what that does is it allows for the big finance that can come over and say we can transform the whole ownership and then you and you in turn can then say yeah Of course you do that because I know how I can see a livelihood for myself and for my family and my friends. We're all together. We've got our microgrids working, if that's what it is. We we we can see how we can supplement a life. The the the women farmers, as you described, in India, They're there. They're willing there to say, you know what? It's okay if we don't have the fertilisers. We can do that. The man in the urban area with the mobile phones are talking to each other about, oh, gosh. Can't, we can't because they haven't been able to take that step forward and to take that step forward goes back down to the essence of dignity The sense that I am in the video, I'm not effective. I can find resources, but others do not see them. Yep. I like that. Richard, do you want anything add anything? Yeah. What David says is obviously, For us, pretty obvious, how you need to go about things. What I perhaps would like to to add to the discussion is that I have enormous confidence in mankind's ability to overcome challenges. History has proven that we have Genuine capabilities of innovation and adaptation that we can actually go forward even in very adverse conditions. So that I don't think has changed in any meaningful way. But what we are facing with the climate crisis is this I would call it extremely naive belief that we can actually deal with the outcome later on whatever it might be. For someone who has managed money his whole adult life because it's the only thing I've ever done is basically manage capital. It's an incredibly stupid way of approaching the risks you're running in your own portfolio. You just shouldn't go down certain directions because If the outcomes are catastrophic enough, there is basically no way for you to come back. And we are treating the climate as one of those things that No one seems overly worried that it actually might get so bad that there is no point for us to recover and come back and that for me is just really really bad risk management and how we ended up in a situation where Policymakers all over the world seem to be talking about flexibility regarding net zero and balanced approach, and god knows all the terms There there's peeling out. The naked truth in that sense and the unsustainable truth of it all is that we are facing potential Catastrophic consequences because of our failure to deal with issues upfront. And there comes the individual responsibility because the whole global economic system is basically made up of each and every one individual choices we make regarding our consumption and production. So if we are unable to change Going forward on an individual basis, it's pretty stupid to believe that the system at large will do so by some crazy autonomous force because it won't. And we will have the ability to overcome using less oil, gas, and coal Because that has been proven throughout history that when you constrain the supply and the availability of resources, we find other ways of being able to do what we want to do. It's just that it takes a little bit of time to adapt and here there seems to be at least on the face of it Many, many voices who said we don't need to do that. We will fix it later down the road somehow. I, I think it's an incredibly naive. And from My working perspective, it's almost an insane approach to to managing risks. And that for me is just bonkers, really. Yeah. Yeah. Of course. Alright. So what can everyone do to get involved? Look out for the hashtag it's for you. I'll I'll put it up here. You can sign up and be part of this. Yes. And and and let me try and put him into the comments or or or chat along. So there's a there's a link to sign up. And and and what we are asking for people when when they sign up, what what you're doing to it's for you and and what we will be doing in that case is so that, you know, we can have you share and be part of our conversations and be part of part of part of this that goes along. And this is, this is a a very, very helpful thing. But, Really, it's about giving yourself a voice. Whether you sign up or otherwise is to use those 12 days To find for yourself and give yourself that voice and to feel that, actually, you don't have to be defensive about having a voice in that way, whatever it is. You don't have to push for it beyond what you think might be might be the case and and so on. But with giving yourself a voice, you're giving yourself that dignity to yourself. And with that, that's how our transformation starts and reconnecting as we go on. There's an activity we did, which I urge everyone to do, And it's a very simple thing. And what it is is to think of nature and think of dignity as gifts for you. Just think of that. What what would that be? And then just get a piece of paper and some colors and express what that is for you on a piece of paper with some colors. And that's a very straightforward thing. As you do so, pay attention to how you feel, How how your sensations, your mind, your body is undergoing a transformation with it Because you're reconnecting with what it is for you. And to Express that into a physical actual transformation. Turn that piece of paper into an object. Make it into a fan so that you can fan yourself when it gets too hot. Make it into a box so they can put special trinkets and special things in there to remind you. Make it into a star so that you can put on your fridge magnet over your fridge and so that you can just remember every day of that connection with nature and with dignity. And that's the kind of things that we ask about. And, of course, if you do do that, then tell us about it. You know, sign up. There's a Facebook group called It's For You Earth. It's a public group. Just join along and share your experiences. The other things we ask for is, Connect with us. We want to create a the ultimate book of trees. Now this is about your personal story of tree. You know, the the tree you used to swing on as a kid, the tree your your child is watering in the garden and that you go along, or the apple tree where, you know, it's still bearing your fruits after 15 years or whichever it is and write a part of that. So so Take an a 4 page, put on it a picture of the tree, you know, a date, you know, when when you got to know this tree, what kind of tree it is, what it's useful, good for. But most of all, write your personal story about it. And the idea is that if we post all of these together, and then we end up with literally a physical book of trees. And that's the connection we want, the connection back to our own stories and connection back to nature. And It may sound odd coming from, you know, 30 years in finance to talk about these things. But the reality we have come to understand is we need to take the climate challenges beyond climate. We need to take them into our everyday lives, into our experiences into our nostalgic memories, and we need to bring those forward to the next step. And to do that, We cannot simply treat the climate challenges as a set of problems to solve because, fundamentally, it's about our own acceptance of where we are so that we can find the direction that's right for ourselves and take a step in that direction. So that's what It's For You is about. I love that, the book of trees. I think it's awesome. I was just thinking back through all my tree memories. We got some great ones. You've you've brought together an incredible group of people, and we're we're gonna be meeting them over the coming weeks. Do you wanna do you wanna tell us about some of the people in the in the in the gang so far? Yeah. Obviously, it's quite a diverse group of People like you said, just David and I. We have the cofounder of the World Climate School, a Norwegian lady with extreme experience about how climate works and connected to so many parts of the world. And, she is, very, very strong on the educational aspect, which we feel is Super important going forward because there actually isn't enough knowledge about these issues. Then we have, couple of African guys that have joined in. They all represent the EACCGN, which is East African Colleges and Campuses, Green Network, an organization full of students and enthusiasm that are extremely knowledgeable. And, That youthful energy is needed when, you know, you have 2 guys like David and me. So that, that brings a very youthful aspect to it all. And then we have, Pakistani girl lady. Well, she's a fair bit younger than us, Sadaf, who Is very knowledgeable with all these things that are technical and virtual and campaigning. And she's been instrumental in Basically orchestrating the way we approach and do and assemble our activities because it's it's very important that It's for You touches on every aspect, of our daily lives. So I think when you log on and Sign up, you will find something that is for you within that whole program and I know for a second I'm naive enough to think that Everything we're doing will be appealing to everyone in 100% of the program, and that's not the point. The point is that there will be bits and Pieces in there that will really connect to each and every one of us depending on our viewpoint about what's going on and how it should be tackled And what are the things that actually give you real meaning and joy in life and and and emphasize on those points. So It's a little bit like a vast program or a big newspaper. You don't read it from front to back page, but you will find enough articles in there That would tick your box, and hopefully, that is what we will manage to do over these 12 days. Yeah. I I'd like to add also that, you know, we there there's no doubt no mistaking about it. What we face is a challenge. What we face is things which, is of great anxiety, bring that can bring a lot of anxiety and concerns to people. And and in that way, we are hoping somehow that there is a magical cure, and this is the way we go forward and in in that sense. But, Increasingly, I've come to the mind that, actually, the more important thing is ask, what is gonna keep us going in the right direction? You know, when you get up in the morning so that your your day is filled with hope, is filled with energy and enthusiasm ahead. And for that part of it, what we also incorporate within this in the middle of each day, the day starts in the early mornings. The the The the live events are broadcast between 7 and 10 in in the evening, in Tokyo time, and then later in In Pakistan time and then later in London time, and one of those is repeated later in Los Angeles time, so that we we go around the world. And at the start of the London time period is happens to be a moment at 2 o'clock where you're just thinking of going to bed if you're out in the Far East, And you're just about getting up if you're far west in that way. And so that's the point that we've chosen to connect up In in that kind of spiritual manner, not necessarily in any way religious or or otherwise, You you can do that in a meditative, reflective, spiritual manner. Essentially, it's a moment where we can reach out To recognize that we are all part of the nature around us. And for us to do that, that ultimately, for me personally, Lets me know that no matter what the conversations and the dialogue and the news reporting that may come out of COP 28, and the failures and how people talk about the washing of this or the washing of fats and and whatever it is. Mhmm. The that's the connection That we want to be able to reinforce each day and remind ourselves of the things that give us joy, of the reasons why This is something that we want to continue on of whichever directions comes from preserving our capital, Looking after our common home for our children, or just simply because we feel this is a thing to do, or I'm an entrepreneur and I happen to think that's a great opportunity to make money. Whatever it is, there is an aspect of this which is not about the outcome, but about being a part of it because we are all a part of the nation around us. And that is what that what gives us that dignity. So so we have that segment in there, and I consider that to be very important. It's very central to all of us. Yeah. Absolutely. Because it it is hard. It's a it's a hard journey once you're on it to stay hopeful. So just reconnecting back to, You know what it's all about and the things that give you joy. Right? It's really simple. Yep. Yeah. That's, it's something I've been doing a lot more. I've been much more present in the moment, you know. Interactions with a stranger are much more meaningful. Or just stopping and watching butterflies, you know, as they As I pulling out my bougainvillea, you know, so, yeah, I I I really resonate with that. So we're gonna have you both back on the 12th day of this, And we'll talk about COP and what's happened because, I mean, we're already seeing all sorts of news coming out about scandals and things going on. There's not a lot of hope in the world, but, for success, but, you know, I think regardless of what happens at COP 28, we've gotta keep doing this anyway and gotta keep going anyway. So I'm looking forward to having you back then. And in between, we'll I'll I'll everyone will get to meet all these other fabulous people you've brought together. And, Yeah. So keep the faith. Keep the hope alive. Right? Yes. Thank you. Absolutely. So Friday, we start, 10 o'clock GMT, 7 PM Tokyo time. That's when we start there. We will be starting our our our broadcasts. As Mike Tyson said, you know, everyone has a plan until you get punched in the mouth. So we expect it all to go sort of funny, depending on pear shaped along. But, You know, we have the enthusiasm. We have the interest. And do sign up so that you can be part of it, and we can feature you along. We can prerecord you. You can come to us live, whichever it is, so that we can see you can share your thoughts and, and, and ideas. Yeah. You guys have put a massive amount of effort into this. A massive. So Richard? Absolutely. It's, it's been a journey. We're here now. We're very grateful that we've come this far and now it's really just the delivery left And, I think whatever we end up doing, you have to feel that This is what was right for me to do at this point in time, and that's really the starting point. And by signing up, you should think about what is right for you to do at this point in time. Yeah. And it's been a pleasure being here, Andreas. So thank you so much. Thanks for asking me to do it. I appreciate it. Alright. See you Tomorrow for our next interview. Alright. Thanks, guys. Thank you. Thank you.