The Know Show – can we do good while doing well?

An insightful article was published in Foreign Policy, titled ‘Will Brazil Destroy the Amazon to Save the Climate?’ (Link below). It’s a compelling read, looking into the untapped reserves of precious metals which, unfortunately, are waiting to be plundered beneath the Amazon Rainforest. The focus of the article is, if we want to build our renewable energy future and move away from fossil fuels, we will need these precious metals. However, at what cost? 

The World Bank estimates we will need three billion tons of critical strategic minerals by 2050 to feed global demand, and currently, Brazil is not even a major player in this sector. Will that change? And if it does, what does it mean for the Amazon Rainforest and the Indigenous communities that rely on its bounty? What does it mean for the world?

However, an interesting part of the article discusses the mining companies and investors understanding that they must work to ensure nature and indigenous groups thrive, while also mining for these metals. Is it greenwashing? Or can we put cynicism aside and see we are finally turning a corner? Join the discussion. 

We are delighted to welcome Guan Hin Tay, who is the creative chairman at BBDO Singapore and president of the Asia Professional Speakers Singapore (APSS). A creative genius and a wonderful human being, we are so happy Guan said yes to joining in our conversation. 

The Know Show is a Livestream held every fortnight on Friday, where Andrea T Edwards, Tim Wade and Joe Augustin, and at least one special guest, review the news that’s getting everyone’s attention, as well as perhaps what requires our attention. We’ll talk about what it means to us, the world and we hope to inspire great conversations on the news that matters in the world today. 

The Know Show is based on Andrea T Edwards Weekend Reads, which are published every Saturday on andreatedwards.com, and covers the climate crisis, topical moments in the world, global politics, business, social issues, and passion/humor/history. Join us. 

Article for discussion https://foreignpolicy.com/2023/04/22/brazil-lula-amazon-climate-environment-mining-minerals-energy-transition-electric-cars-ev-batteris-metals-rare-earths/?tpcc=recirc_latest062921 

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To get in touch with me, all of my contact details are here https://linktr.ee/andreatedwards

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Transcript

Unknown: 0:04

Welcome to the no show. My name is Andrew Edwards. I'm Tim Wade. And my name is Joe Augustine, and welcome to the no show the show that tries to explore the other side of the News, the news you may not have seen, not just not because it didn't happen, or it's not unverified or whatever it is just because it's telling us the attention it deserves. And we try to also get a diverse perspective on the show. So we have a guest every show whenever we can try to whenever we can be insecure, when today's guests is someone who is no stranger to any of these two, but maybe to you. He is the president of the Asia professional speakings professional speakers, Singapore, as well as the creative chairman of BBDO, Singapore, and his name is take one hand, or as some people call him, the horn. 1111 and only Yeah. Nice. So welcome to the show. Why maybe a few moments to talk about what you do. And before we get to the to the meat the show today. Yeah, so thank you so much for inviting me, it's always a pleasure to, you know, to speak to all of you. So my name is taken in as what Joe is introduced. And I'm the creator, Chairman of BBDO, Singapore. BBDO is one of the top five global networks around the world. And we focus on creating the work, the work, the work, which is all about big ideas, campaigns, and we do everything from social media. And hopefully, you know, with what we're discussing today, I'll be able to give my insights on creativity, what's happening around the world, but overall, I'm really excited to be here. That's great to know him. He's one of the harder ones to tie down because he's a busy man. All right, so should we get into some of the quick takes and see if there's any of any of these that are getting your attention? Or maybe some others? So, Mary Austin, who is obviously the not obviously to everyone, is Freddie Mercury's greatest love has decided to sell off Freddie's treasures. And if you're wealthy enough, and you love me, please, can you buy me the crown? I think its reserve price is 60 to 80,000 pounds. I don't think I can get that over the line with Steve. But yeah, so it's an amazingly beautiful classy items for that are going up for auction in the summer. We've had some Notable deaths. So Jerry Springer came through overnight. For us out here in Asia, Harry Belafonte, who was not just an incredible musician, but he was also an activist to, you know, change the course of history. And of course, Australians mourn to Barry Humphries, aka Dame Edna everage, as well. So all sort of older, you know, older people passing away so the other big story that when the media went nuts was, of course, that it was announced that Tucker Carlson and Don Lamont, were both fired this week. It's a new shiny thing for everyone to be paying attention to. And everyone was talking about it and trying to work out what had actually happened even though none of us really know. Although some some if you if you can give, give it some time, which most people don't with the news. There's some interesting insights coming out. The fighting in Sudan continues, and it could threaten to send the entire region into conflict. There's some really interesting news pieces around what's going on over there. I encourage you to pay attention to that as well. Donald Trump is in court. Here I am smiling. But it seems that he could be quite busy in the coming months and years ahead, facing battles in multiple states for multiple on multiple fronts, but I recommend keeping an eye on E Jean Carroll. She is pulling no punches. So she's accused Donald Trump of rape. There's a hashtag called I didn't scream. And I would recommend looking in that and that is other women talking up about the fact that when they were raped, they also didn't scream. It doesn't mean you weren't raped, just because you didn't scream. And Musk is of course always in the news, but after taking away Twitter blue for the famous and the influential, he very quickly decided to give it back there was a lot of interesting conversation but Midler was Top of the Pops for me. Did you guys pay attention to any of that calm conversation? Well, I like tweets. Yeah, I'll let me give the update though. She's had it taken away, give him back and then taken away again. Oh, how she Yeah, she well, she did a little bit of a, I think a bit of a standard bit of a gag which she put out but she actually gave out a blue tag that could be everyone could just copy and basically put against their name. So everyone Haven't everyone could have a blue tick it was it was it was a hyper, you know, you just replace your picture with the blue tick. So it looks like the blue tick your name right? And apparently that might have set Elon Musk off again because she's had her blue tick removed, and once again moved the wind beneath her wings. Yeah. We can't say who you are, but we love you too. Yeah, it's fun and games and certainly a lot of creativity. Any other of the big stories going on? I mean, there's Disney and DeSantis there's so many other stories, anything else that you guys sort of paying attention to beyond? Beyond what we're going to discuss? Not really. I'm gonna be honest with you. I've had very little time to look at different things. Yeah, yeah. Well, thankfully, we've got the no show. All right. So let's, let's kick off the big sort of stories that we're going to cover. And right, click Clinton Sia. Yeah, it makes me happy to Clinton and I would be, I'll be stuck with a conviction. Alright, so, Kate, let's just move this. All right. So off the charts, and uncharted territory, becoming common phrases regarding the climate. So one example and UN report off the charts, melting of glaciers, so we're gonna see, unbelievable sea rises in the coming years. Another one record, record, ocean temperature puts Earth in uncharted territory, say scientists. There's an article monster heat hits 1/3 of the world's population. But you might have actually missed this because I've been speaking to people around the world who are unaware of the heatwave that Asia Southeast Asia is experiencing at the moment. How lots have been in Singapore. It's been it's been a bit warmer than usual. I don't know the exact temperature outside, but it definitely has been much warmer than it has usually been. Yeah. Shawn McEwen said he was out walking at night, six o'clock in the morning, and it was already 36 degrees. So that's, that's hot. Yeah, it was, but there's one here at 8am. Right? There's one chart that's getting a lot of attention. It's a story I've been tracking all year. And it's record warming that's happening in the oceans. And there's a few, quite a few articles on this, where the basically the scientists don't even want to talk about it, because it's freaking them out so much. But there's this other publication, it's called Yale Climate Connections, if you're interested in the climate, I really recommend following it. And it's it's reporting a situation that is going against climate predictions. It's one of the only ones but basically, Enzo, which stands for the El Nino Southern Oscillation, isn't doing what the climate scientists expected it should be doing. And they're saying that it's going to have major implications for the Atlantic hurricane season, droughts in the US Southwest and the Horn of Africa, which is already going through an extreme drought, as well as other things like, you know, the horrible floods that we've seen on the east coast of Australia, the drying out of the subtropical region. And when I look out my window, it's all brown. It's that that just horrifies me. And so it's not doing what it's supposed to do. And it's actually doing the opposite of what it's supposed to do. So I'm trying to understand what that means. And I haven't, I can't quite grasp it yet, because there's so many conversations going on around the impending El Nino, and what it means. But there's another story that isn't getting the attention that it really deserves, especially in this part of the world. And I as as we're going through it, I want to share it, because we need to understand that very dangerous phase that we've now entered. So in Thailand on the 14th of April, it recorded its hottest ever temperature, which is 45.4, which I think we discussed in the last no show, right? On the 25th of April, Thailand issued a don't go out warning for Bangkok, as the heat index hit a record of 54 degrees Celsius. And this is something that we need to understand there's a difference between the temperature and the heat index. And it's the difference between life and death. Right. So a heat index of 54 degrees Celsius is one degree under deadly wet bulb temperatures for all of us. And although it's already deadly for many 54 degrees C. So when you look at your weather app, and it says the temperature if it's 35 degrees Celsius or higher, and then the heat index or the feels like temperature is 55 degrees C or higher. That's wet bulb temperatures. And it means even if you're young, healthy, you're in the shade you got plenty of water, you will still die. Right? So that's we're in Thailand, we're one degree off that so That's, that's how crazy it is. So in wet bulb temperatures, you cook from the inside out. And it's very rapid. And if once once you're impacted, you got minutes to get to emergency medical care to save your life. There was a politician here in Thailand a few weeks ago who died on the golf course. So they've got national attention and national awareness. So pay attention to the feels like temperature or the heat index, because that what it's doing that feels like it's measuring the amount of moisture in the air. As the world warms, for every point, one degree of warming, that's 7% more moisture in the air. And that's what we've got to be paying attention to. So we're already in that territory. Now, I really encourage everyone to understand wet bulb temperatures, what it means how to protect yourself. And if you're in a place where these temperatures are already happening, the media government and all of the businesses need to start really pushing this information out and educating people about what they can do about it. And obviously, I'm incredibly concerned about this for my family, but I'm also mostly concerned for the people who have the least who are living in homes with no ability to call call themselves they've got tin roofs, it's incredibly hot, that they're going to be the ones to die. So yeah, we're, we've entered a new territory for for for the climate emergency. And I just want people to take it seriously, because I don't think people are quite understanding what this means yet. It's one of those things where people have gotten used to the idea of a 35 degree day or 36 degree day. And without realising or factoring in things like humidity, to understand how that works, and because like if I mean I, I've been in Australia, like in the middle of the desert, down the middle of May Ayers Rock, for instance. Right. And temperatures, they can go much higher than that. But it's not, it's not quite as dangerous because it's not as arid. So it's not as it's not as humid. So that that that that factor isn't as bad. But this this whole thing about the global heat index thing that's interesting, because of that, that that high moisture in the air, it actually makes it impossible for the body to try to cool itself out any other way. Yeah. I mean, all the media should have wet bulb temperatures on the front page, right? You know, that we're not even doing that yet. Sorry, one. So in Singapore, there was the big news about, obviously, there's a lot of foreign workers, you know, building construction, and they've given them extra extra time and also offering extra water. So I think even though people are working outside needs to be treated fairly. If not, you'll get lots of, you know, health cases popping up to Yeah, I say the construction workers in the middle of the day here, you know, and they just shouldn't, I mean, we've got to change working out. It's not just construction workers, farmers are the whole agricultural sector, travel and tourism, all of it, you know, people need to be aware of it, and they need to be aware of the danger for themselves. And I don't think that awareness is has even begun, you know, it's and then the hotter you get, like the worst, the worse it is, because then your infrastructure starts to melt, because it overheat. So you lose your electricity, which means you can't call yourself you lose your telco you lose, your emergency services can't go out. If you start eating 50 degrees Celsius, the temperature, then, you know, tarmac starts to melt. So the roads start to melt, so you can't get in. So we've got, I've been starting to put together a paper of all the different things that we've got to start looking at doing in our communities, because we're on the way to that now. And we need to be ready before it actually really hits. And the numbers of people getting skin cancer is also going to increase you so everything related. It's all kind of correlated to each other. Yeah. Well, there's a bit of news here. It's got a bit of a buzz as well here because you know, if you've been following the story of Tanaka, Tanaka Raja Supriya Richard Branson's taken a personal interest in this story and basically was very critical of the Singapore government and the use of the death penalty. And a few days ago, Singapore basically carried out the execution Tinago Raju and the big story was actually have you lost me? Yeah, the back your back? Yep. So, Singapore carried out the execution. Yeah, they carried out the execution and with with a with a with a quite open rebuttal or rebuke of Richard Branson's comments about the topic because he's been quite vocal about this and he's made some he's made some some some suggestions that the The man was an innocent man. And I think what what the image is to the Ministry of Home Affairs here has kind of defied or described Richard Branson's comments as being disrespectful I think in a sense of in one sense in terms of sovereignty, that's one thing, but also in terms of the kind of attitude that that is being expressed in terms of how he's asserting certain things about the case, without maybe having all the access to the information as well. And I think the it I think he cast the tone that he had kind of cast the light that Singapore was quite careless about how it went about with the investigation, and then the prosecution done I mean, the image is perspective is that isn't true. And and of course, along the way, as well, I mean, they were there was an offer to have Richard Branson come to Singapore for a live on camera debate with our law minister, which he turned down. So you know, it's it's it's been a series of actions from afar. It's from Singapore perspective, I think, not very popular with with the local way of doing things, which is basically don't Don't meddle with us, especially if we're giving you a chance to come in here and have a conversation. The idea that he wants you to pedal is influenced from from far like that and without, without, substantiation is a bit challenging. I think that's what this has been described generally. So, anyway, the story, the story was that, you know, the idea was that maybe maybe he wasn't this guy, who was, who was actually distributing, you know, whatever, and all that. And when the evidence actually suggests otherwise, there is, you know, he's not a king in distributor, but he was actually engaged in the thing that he was convicted of, which is basically the distribution of cannabis, which under the law currently still attracts the death penalty. Do you think the action in this case was just about really getting the message over about cannabis? Because, of course, we Thailand, legalising cannabis, I think it sort of sent Singapore into a bit of a tailspin that their kids can jump on a plane and go go to Pattaya for the weekend, get stoned and come home. And, and there's been a lot of messages in Singapore about, you know, like, even if you consume overseas and come back, you can still be in trouble. Do you think it's all linked to that sort of making? I think I think we're all in the same, it's from the same, you know, the same the same same area. But I would say that the two things. One One is about the law and how law is approached with in every country, you have to look at what precedent is and what you what you what what the word law is and what happens. So there's certain checks along the way that you have to kind of tick off and if legally, these are the checks in place, if you trip all those, those legal trip wires, and there's a mandatory death sentence attached to that, based on the law, you have to you have to follow through with that. So that's that's part of it. The other part, of course, as you talk about in terms of availability of drugs in around the world, in in the area, that there is a lot of messaging around that they're reminding people as you leave the Singapore as you leave from the airport that you are not supposed to take drugs while you're overseas, because you can be prosecuted on the way back. That's that's certainly something that has been consistent throughout the whole Singapore line. I think Singapore, if you look at countries around the world are likely to adopt a more lenient stance on drugs. Singapore is way down on that list. Yeah, I wonder though, if, when I think about it, there's an element of when you're in a particular country, and you've been following the the narrative or the political shift in ideology with regards to drugs, or gender or anything. And, and then you you go, yep, that's what I think. And then another country doesn't do that. There's a, there's an element of you need to you need to believe you need to believe and follow what I believe and follow and, and what my rules are in the country that I'm in, rather than the rules that are in your country. And there seems to be an attempt at homogenization, this is where we get a lot of social media conflict as well. An attempt to say the whole world should believe this, and they don't but then at the same time, there's Why pick on Singapore, because there's lots of places where death penalty is happening. So if you're picking on Singapore, because it's a smaller country, then then surely that comes down to bullying in a sense, unless they're saying, well, Singapore is supposed to be first world and progressive and everything else. And so they're picking on Singapore for that perspective. But you know, why not pick on Saudi Arabia? Why not pick on some of these other countries in Africa, wherever it is, why not pick on those ones? And it's, maybe it's something to do The media, maybe it's not getting you the, you know, the attention, but it's all about the brands. It's all about the war on drugs, right as a failure. That's his core message. Well, to be fair as well, I mean, with with brands, and he does not just talk about Singapore, he talks about wherever wherever it's happening. Singapore's only responded, you know. So that's why that's why we kind of a bigger than everyone else ignores him. Yeah, I guess maybe it's a, it's a, it's a really tough one, because it comes down to it really, when you when you put it in a pan and boil it down, you're going to end up with values, and, and a way of trying to protect your people in one sense, you know, and so it is, it's a minefield anyway. So I shall, yeah. Shall I talk about COVID? Yep. It's funny, I'm going to talk about COVID. But we don't really talk about COVID-19. Much more. It feels like everybody's moved on. We're not really interested. But there's it's a bit of a good news story from a science perspective. And yeah, but it recent study is worth highlighting. So let's just get into that it's featured in Science Alert. It's a massive US based study involving 10s of 1000s of military veterans. And it's concluded that there is a negligible risk of developing a blood clot as a result of COVID 19 vaccine. Remember, when it was coming out, we're all going to get vaccinated. That was the big thing like, Hey, you get a blood clot. And a lot of elderly were a bit worried about it and everything, but this is a huge study. So while it is expected that the results will do little to convince anti vaccine advocates of the relative safety of vaccinations, hopefully it'll reinforce confidence and in communities that vaccines are far safer than the disease that they're intended to prevent. Which is known to elevate risks of developing a venous thromboembolism embolism. Try saying that five times after Thailand. So essentially, given the larger risk of VT from COVID-19 infection, the risk benefit ratio strongly favoured vaccination. So if you've been vaccinated, sit back, relax and enjoy the flight. Just to add a little bit to COVID as well, there's some there's some progress being made as well in the treatment of long COVID. I don't have more details than just that. But there's some good news for anyone who's you know, suffering long COVID helped me becoming Oh, cool, because so I just saw that one in 10 people are expected to develop long COVID, which is going to be a massive issue globally. So that's good news. Cool. That is good news. I'm Yeah, I feel I feel aggrieved that we don't have any data on it. But But yes. Share it with me. We'll find it we'll find it and we'll let you know. Okay. Yeah. Did you know how much meant us spent on the metaverse? Any any ideas? I know it costs the share price. A lot. Yeah. That was all I cared about. Yeah. So in in, in October, last year. Metis spent $36 billion dollars on the metaverse Yeah.$36 billion. And according to some, you know, news, it's a million dollar per month, something something like that. But guess what? Over the last, well over the last few days, they are abandoning this whole Metaverse, or mark is abandoning abandoning it. And I'm chasing after you know, the next chat GBT, which is the generative AI. So apparently, what they're trying to do is to try and integrate all their advertising are gearing up to deploy the AI into advertising. Because this is the channel where the company makes the most amount of money as opposed to the metaverse which is an experiment multibillion dollar failure to them, but in my opinion, right, I think the metaverse you know, obviously everybody's trying to jump into the metaverse. Perhaps what you're doing is to create something that's too expensive for people to take on. When when Chad GPT came on board. I felt that it was a success because number one, it was free. It was something that people needed. It was simple to use. And I feel that you know, maybe that's something that the metaverse or, or whoever was going to create should make it as friendly and relatable and human as possible and The other thing too, you know, the CTO Andrew Bosworth said the company's Metaverse has all been been abandoned by by Mark Wright, who's now instead be spending the bulk of his time chasing in sorry, chasing and creating generative AI. So, you know, it's interesting that everyone is always chasing chasing for the shiny new toy. And generative AI is supposed to be the answer. So how did they miss that though? Maybe they didn't, they didn't matter. I mean, AI has been around for for a good seven, eight years anyway. And you know, in terms of what what he feeds you, and what the algorithms were all that AI anyway. So it's not something that it's a myth, it's just the attention. It gathered, or at least it's drawn as much attention. I'm just listening, reading between the lines there. So the CTO talks about how much interested in this, it doesn't mean that the company is no longer interested in just as he's that Mark, is very much an you know, like, like, like, now, or he didn't have to imagine he didn't have the imagination to see the path of AI that has now come out is that do you think it's more that right? Well, if you're looking at AI literally two years ago, I mean, we were looking at stuff like how it can right and can do kind of different things. I was listening to podcasts where they had aI doing poetry and all that all that stuff, right? So the stuff that we're seeing today isn't new, it's only become mainstream as people have come to know about it. And it's kind of a big kind of thing, right? I mean, so the idea that a computer can chat in a way that seems human has been around for actually a few years. But now more and more people are experiencing for themselves. So what we're doing is we're getting this social proof kind of thing, right? So like the way perhaps a few years ago, a few people knew of Bitcoin and then more people know about Bitcoin and then you know, who knows, right? It's that kind of, it's called, it's called network when when there's enough network knowledge about something, then it becomes something, because it's no point if a few of us just okay, I mean, long before I mean, before before Wordle exploded. They were the few people who liked Bordeaux, and then it exploded and everyone the word Oh, yeah. But I think this is a bit different. I think. I think the last time I saw something like this happened was Google. And I was working in yellow pages at the time. So that was a big deal. Because no one would have the search engine the first search and when he came out, and we're on there, and it was just like, oh my gosh, that does that does what we do is a book with a book. And it was like, This is amazing. And then it would like film everyone was using it was a lot of other things have been slow burn. But check GBT has gone full. Like you've said it's gone mainstream. Sure. It's been in the works and been happening for a while, but But it's gone very, very quick. And the fact is, though, that marks business is frontline technology. And it feels like he's missed the front. And he's playing catch up a little bit. Or is, you know, don't you think? Yeah, I for me, for me, it reminds me of Bill Gates. When the internet came about, so I don't know if you guys remember that. He just, he really he really held back and then he was all in. But so most people forget that. But it was it was it was an interesting. So it was interesting to watch that like how can you be missing that can't to me it feels like that. But I get the Google comparison to well, it is a reframe reframe of this for you, right? Think Metaverse think about two years ago. Now, how could you be the person who missed the metaverse, right? You could go into early, you could try and do it and you could you could develop everything and you could be wrong. So you know, Google's done a few of those things. So Google has, for instance, a number of moonshot projects it's gone into some of which hasn't produced any fruit at all. I mean, some really, really cool big ideas, but it just hasn't gone anywhere. So you can you can even tell about that. I mean, like, like, like, if you if you were if you were in the world of chat, GBT, two years ago, you would have been wondering, why isn't the world more excited about this? Why is it doing everything it can, you know, so if you look at chat, like GPD for now, right just tells you how many versions they've been before as well. So it's not a new thing. But it's caught fire now. And it's very hard to tell what the future is going to be because I was I was listening to the history of the Segway. For instance, it was supposed to absolutely change the world and make the inventor a multi billion air. And it didn't none of that. And now what they do is they do hoverboards for kids. I mean, but the thing is, Metaverse is it's for me it's it feels like terraforming a planet it's gonna take a while or or it's it's its use case is not clear with chatty BTW the use case is extremely clear. Because you go in and go, does it do that? Oh my gosh, it does that. That's amazing. I love this thing. And then you know you tell people about Got it. You know, I just put it in a list of email addresses and go tell me their first name. And it gave me the first name of the ones that it could give me the first name. And I said, if you don't know, if it's not obvious, then they just leave it blank gave me a list. And I was like, Oh, this is amazing. So you know, it's and because of that, because it because the use case becomes clear when you play with it. Where's the metaverse? It's like, I don't even know how to get there. I don't know what does and so terraforming it and it sounds expensive, and what the hell is the point of it? So it's, you know, that's kind of that's that's kind of, I think, just gone. Boom. Right? Um, so the metaverse in my opinion has existed even before Mark Zuckerberg is doing it. So I play Roblox with my daughter. And Roblox is an example of a Metaverse that is easy to use, it's interactive, and it's you know, it's free. So in any new invention, to be adopted, and to be, you know, sort of embraced by the public. It's got to be, I think what Tim said, it's got to be simple, relevant, and timing means everything. So you know, when Google Glass came out to write, I mean, adopted and was killed. So for example, the metaverse, you know, the ocular, the hit where it's about $2,000, who's going to pay $2,000 for a headset like this. So I think what chat GPT that did was that it's free. Remember, it was free, it was easy to use, and it was very, very human. And those are the three components that make this so popular. If so, my opinion is that the metaverse for example, Roblox can easily do something much faster than Facebook, whereas Facebook was trying to start from scratch. That's interesting, the comment about it being free because you know, social media is free and liquid, it's done to societies and democracies, right. So I personally would prefer to pay$2,000 for a headset rather than free. Because I know that I'm then the product. When you know, I'm still paying attention to that side of the story. Yeah. I think the interesting thing with every software that's come up, it's free for all. And once you become addicted to it, or you're stuck, then you start charging on the time being paid. Yep. Yeah, I've been paying $20 Check GBT because I didn't want, I needed so badly that I need to use it. So I think it's a way to hook people in and after a while you can do without it. Basic, I love it. I still haven't got access to it. I applied months ago, and I've got no access to it. I didn't even say that as an option. So well. They it still can't search for information better than I can. So it has to it has to be better at that for me before I'll I'll really jump on board for you need four or five for that one, five coming out later this year. If you if you want three, it's still it's two year old data. And you're looking for no show stuff that is now and relevant and stuff. So it's a bit different. Yeah. But for me looking at Biblical stuff. It's fantastic. Because all that data is a good point. All right, so just moving on. So I'm shorting this one down. But there's a lot of talk, you know, it's another climate story. But there's another talk about carbon dioxide, carbon dioxide removal technology. And it's it's one of these conversations just like people have for and against and but it's so the term, the correct term is carbon capture and storage or the acronym is CCS. So you'll see it more and more. John Kerry has been in the news a lot ECU and he's the US climate envoy. And I don't know if you guys ever listened to an easy interviews, but the I like our pragmatic. He's he's, you know, he's realistic. He sort of talks about things like, you know, even the willow project, which everyone's up in arms against, and he's talking about it within a different context. So it's, you know, but but basically what he's saying, if we only use the CCS technology, if that's where we put all of our money, we're going to fail. And he's saying we're already basically we're, you know, according to the science, we're already past the major tipping points. That's basically irreversible. But when it comes to CCS, carbon capture and storage technology. I mean, there's so many angles to this, but we need to be putting money into that. But we need to be putting money into all the other things, but the biggest area that we should be putting money into, which was not which is not getting anywhere near the the percentage of investment is local rewilding, you know, and I think we talked about that a couple of weeks ago as well, but there's some really good pieces and interviews with John Kerry. He's obviously very, very passionate. He's still talking about not surpassing 1.5 Warming. I don't know why the politicians are still entertaining that the scientists have long since said we're past it, but anyway, It's, there's some interesting content around him. And that'll be in my weekend read. So check it out, Joe. A very quick comment about politics and why sometimes I think we don't want to say we've already gone past the point of no return. There's a there's a tendency for people to do to enter, the more we give up, and I think it's been shown to be in many, many things, when you say things that are beyond the point of, of control, or whatever it is, that it actually gets worse so that I can I can, I can call out some examples or things like that. But the moment people think that there's a problem, and it's a big problem, then they go like, well, then I can't stop it. So that I think that's maybe a bit if we're not, but we're not acknowledging the problem enough to get ready to deal with the problem. Yeah. And, and that's the problem. So it's, you know, there's, I mean, the Doom sort of sphere is growing, what people are in despair, you know, but we've got to get ready, we're going to do the stuff we need to do still, right. I liken it to being a parent and seeing a child who hasn't quite prepared for the exams, you have to speak to him as though he can pass the exam. Even though with your wife, you'll say something else. There's a there's an article about Jeffrey Sachs, his comments on the historic push by China for a multipolar world to end us domination. It's in democracy now. But the gist of it basically is China is showing up in the world and in a big way, not just in terms of its absolute presence, and just being an economic power, but actually now getting involved in the idea of diplomacy and, and plans for peace, which is kind of a different role for China, when you when you roll back the clock a few years, because it used to be very much about we'll sit back and passively sit and see what happens and placidly move along well, Laplace, if you think about China, its traditional, you know, sabre rattling, and stuff like that, but it would be a little hands off in a bit from a distance. But it has been more hands on and I think it especially if you bring attention to areas like Africa, you will realise China's very much hands on in that particular area. And so they have a lot of credibility when they offer their help. Nowadays, people don't just think that it's just I'm just saying what I can do they know China can can back it up as well. So China's involved now with peacemaking in the Ukraine, which is comes at a very interesting time, when you look at what the US is view as released in the in the data leaks, from a couple of weeks ago, reveal that they don't have much faith in the in that wall coming to a close. And China's saying instead Well, we have a plan which you'd like to work with us. So it's it's it's a first of all, it's taking away the supremacy of the US in one area. And then I guess in other areas as well as it as it pedals its influence been under the China brand means that it's able to and it's just size of it as well as means it's able to influence things. Currency is one big area as well, in which China has an influence because if China makes it well, so so far, it's it's got a very, it doesn't it doesn't have its its currency floating freely in the markets yet. But if it does begin to do that, and that will allow it to be used very reliably for other big transactions, that could make a really big change for now, China's still controls its currency quite a bit. And so it doesn't maybe lend itself necessarily to all these other commodities using the Chinese yuan as the as the standard. But it's gearing up I mean, the machinery and the infrastructure is all in place. I mean, the digital yen, makes it very easy to transact. So if you think cryptocurrency is something that is going away, it may go away in the current form, but expected to show up in the form of digital yen, which is being promoted, by the way quite heavily. And other other versions of digital Fiat, but China is definitely going to be a big influence in that. Have you seen the big growth in bricks as well? The what, you know, the, you know, the BRICs. So, but it's Brazil, Russia, India and China. And now a whole bunch of new countries that are coming in. So that's, that's pretty interesting. Yeah, it's, it's always going to be it's always going to be challenging to it has a basis for coming out. So I mean, I'm I'm involved in something called for instance BBx, which is, which is a barter exchange programme, where you have a different currency or third currency that you can use to kind of exchange products and goods. It can work it has the potential of going really big, but will it ultimately go extra big, and it's a bit like looking at the Rubik's Cube in 1974. Nice idea. could get some All right, but it could be 1980 before it becomes a Christmas here, you know? Nice, Jim. You're gonna have to start ticking along because Guam has to actually leave us. Right on for right? Yeah, he's got a clock behind him. I'm watching it. It's got plenty of time all right. Okay, I got to stop laughing because this next one is kind of serious. The, the it's been 10 years since the Rana Plaza collapse. That's the clothing factory complex outside of Dhaka. In Bangladesh. This catastrophe sold more than 1100 workers killed most of them young women, and injured another 2500. It was the worst industrial accidents in Bhopal and was due to it being a poorly constructed building, which was weakened by the vibrations of a two tonne generator on the roof, the eight story building and visible glow growing cracks in its walls about which workers warned their supervisors the day before the collapse. The workers were told they would lose their jobs if they refuse to return. So they went back the following morning, and many of them ended up beneath the rubble. 10 years later, it continues to offer an opportunity to reflect on the progress that's been made and the work that still needs to be done to ensure decent conditions for Bangladesh has more than 4 million garment workers of 4 million garment workers. This is a critical industry for the country. When Bangladesh gained independence from Pakistan in 1971 80% of its people lived below the the poverty line. Today that percentage stands at 20%, including about 6% who live in extreme poverty. The dramatic growth of the garment sector has been key to the country's economic growth and poverty reduction. In 1984, when the Bangladesh garment manufacturers, manufacturers and exporters association which is BGMEA began keeping records there were 384 garment factories, employing just over 120,000 workers and today, there's an estimated 7000 factories from 384, most producing at least some products for export in 2021 22. export income tied to the apparel industry was over 42 billion, making it the second largest garment exporting country in the world after only after China. This sector accounts for more than 80% of all export income from Bangladesh, which is just crazy. Or much has improved the relationship between Bangladeshi factory owners and their corporate customers, which were badly strained by the COVID pandemic has continued to squeeze the factory owners and it's nothing short of exploitation this exploitation leads to worse conditions for workers who have little power to protect their own well being. So I the concerning part for me is that we there were improvement before COVID. But a new report describes exploitative practices that buyers applied during the pandemic, which have become a new normal with respect to purchasing practices. And these include brands pressuring suppliers to make unreasonable price reductions, delaying deliveries and withholding payments, cancelling bookings and projections, which leaves manufacturers with unused capacity because what the manufacturers do is when they get the interest in the order before the contracts actually signed, they go out and start preparing for it. And then when it doesn't come through, they're left holding all the goods because they have to prepare in advance for it to be delivered. Anyway, the the this delays, deliveries withholds payments, that cancelling booking and projections happens, which leaves manufacturers with unused capacity and raw materials, and using third party intermediaries to place added pressure on suppliers as well. So it's a story worth reading, and a reminder, to do your due diligence on who you buy from, which might be a little bit challenging. I mean, I went ahead look at the Fashion transparency index on Fashion Revolution, a fashion revolution.org. And it was going through a bunch of key findings about major brands as well, with regards to their supply chain traceability and how upfront and transparent they are about stuff. And there's a lot of major brands that still aren't disclosing information about their supply chains. And what goes on in those particular supply chains with regard to work conditions, as well as where they get stuff their carbon neutrality, water, electricity, chemicals, that sort of thing. So it's a it's a tough one. So yeah, keep an eye on it. If they're not if they're not transparent, don't buy from them, you know, who made my clothes. There's another one which is about where human slavery occurs, which businesses linked to slavery. There's a there's a lot of really good the fashion industry or the sustainable fashion industry. They're, they're doing an amazing amount of work trying to educate people but if you if you want to buy something from Louie Vuitton On, and they're not talking about their deforestation practices or anything else that they're linked to, and just don't buy from them until they clean up their act or talk about what they're doing to change. Right. Yeah. Okay. So to be fair, I mean, so this was that particular Fashion Revolution thing was looking at transparency, the global fashion industry. And we're looking at 250 of the world's largest fashion brands and retailers, with brands achieving an overall average score of just 24%, up 1% from last year with a global transparency. However, having said that, 48% of them are publishing their stuff. But 50% aren't publishing anything 40 something right, at least their first tier manufacturers. So it's getting there. And like you're saying there are places that will, there are some brands that are seeing this as a competitive edge? Because it is, because they're being they're being that as well. And it might be worth supporting those brands. Getting fired at Amazon. I know. Actually, when I think about the recent layoffs, something came to mind, which is, have you guys seen jobs to jobs to the tightline leads, just when you thought it was safe to go back to the waters. And Amazon just recently began another round of mass layoffs with meta with lots of other companies. So I can read, I can read through all the list right that Amazon has started to lay off 9000 9000 People get just as laying off 1800 Dropbox too. And also, in terms of this new layoffs, too. I mean, everybody, I mean, I think this year, is really the year of layoffs. And it started with the tech industry. And now Amazon is also facing it. And it's really interesting. One of the things that I've also heard news about the layoffs is that everyone feels like it's coming. But nobody's really prepared about the layoffs. So you know, in LinkedIn, right, you you read lots of people writing about, you know, their experience. But one thing is very, I mean, one thing is really interesting, is that how people are prepared, they're not really prepared at all, even though even though they see it coming. So one of the things I wanted to talk about is how do you prepare for a layoff, which I think it's quite important, as most of us, you know, employable, we don't think about doing our personal branding, I think it's important for us not just to promote the company's brand, but to also promote our own brand. And, and LinkedIn might be the best place to look for a job. But LinkedIn is a horrible place to beg for a job and Houghton to you know, promote ourselves so that when the opportunity comes right, people will start looking for us. I think that's really key. The other thing i The other thing that's really important is networking, and network right now, when you still have a job. I noticed that you know, whenever people who have high positions like you know, a chairman leaves, right, suddenly, nobody's your friend, the title becomes who you are. So I feel that sometimes we don't reach out to the right context. And the clients could be our best friends. Because the clients who pays our bills, and maybe everybody you work with are fake friends, right? I mean, obviously friends, because they want a particular job from you. And I think that the third and most important thing is to prepare well, before the time comes. So whether you, you know, you are able to make sure that you've got the right data to put things together, because I see people fumbling, crying, just really desperate to get the job. So anyway, I mean, the layoffs is going to be something normal. And we just really, I think it's important for us to be prepared. But you guys, I mean, how do you feel about it? You know, me 100% having a voice having an opinion being out there on social media, showing people who you are, what you've got to say not in a not in a false way. And, you know, being yourself, you know, if you want a job, you have to have an opinion, you have to have a point of view, but you have to respond in a you're interacting. You have to have integrity. I think I'm you know, I'm seeing the emotional posts. And sometimes it's like, I don't know if that's the appropriate way. You see, some people go on and they attack the company that's let them go. That's not That's not a smart thing to do if you want to get a job, because now nobody wants to employ you, you know, but, but emotions are running high and some people feel so betrayed and let down by the companies and there's still this trust in businesses taking care of people. When at the end of the day. That's not what that's not the reality, right? But yeah, you got to take care of your voice and make sure your, your resume or CV is up to date as well. Well, I'm gonna speak on behalf of the digital intro But I mean, I, I'm pretty much that I hardly ever do anything online. I mean, I post about once every two weeks when the no show is coming up. But I am someone who is maybe not as, as extroverted, or at least, you know, I don't express myself very much on social media. And I do agree, there's a need for everything you spoke about Andrea, but I don't, it's like one of those things, you go like this, we have to be true to ourselves. And yet, some of the things we have to do, it's like, you know, adulting in the, in the digital world means you have to have a social media account, or a number of social media accounts, which, you know, it may not be an actual thing you do. I mean, you know, it's not the biggest thing, although I say this as I'm, even as we speak, planning a whole series of Tik Tok videos, which I know I must do, at some point. You got to find it, you got to find your own pilots, you know, and, and your own social media channels, but you don't have to do a lot, share an article that you haven't written, somebody else could have written and just put a point of view one paragraph, once a week. And, and tell people why you're sharing it, and why you think they should read it, and what they're going to get from it. You know, it's just, it's not a lot, it's the nuts what, you know, every time I run my training session, I haven't got time for this, I'm like, you can share an article a week, because you're you're reading at least 10, everybody's everybody's paying attention to something that they care about. So it's just about taking that extra step. And, you know, it's it shouldn't be overwhelming. And you know, and you're here, Joe, the introvert is here. So, you know, you're already doing something people know who you are and what you stand for. By being part of this. You know, I think there's there's two other things with regards to the whole layoff thing. One of one of them is so like one was saying is, is prepare yourself. And the other thing is, and preparing yourself is really important insofar as personal branding and getting your message out there. So Andrew is saying, share other people's stories with your opinion, but also share your own stories. And, and stories where you will hear something happen, and now you're there. The problem with the crying out ones at the moment is you hear something happened. There's no end to the story. So nobody's learning anything from it apart from the fact that you're disgruntled. So I think the hero's journey hasn't come to completion in that cycle, you've got to talk about a different cycle, rather than the pain cycle you're in. Some people would say, but the pain cycle makes you authentic, and everything else will sure, but it's, I think it could be brand damaging. In the short term, if you're looking for the job, you can talk about that how it made you feel later, perhaps, I don't know, it's just one of those things. But that how you feel part. I mean, anyone who's been through that, it that from a psychology perspective, it is know who you are, without the company, gonna know who you are, you are, I've been through it before where I was, my identity was so tied up with a particular business, that when I went out of that business, I didn't know who I was anymore. And, and that was really that took, that was, I mean, that was in my 20s That was like, really hard. And, and I think for people who are in a business that thinks that this is the be all and end all of their, who they are and they wear that suit with pride. No, oh, tell me about yourself, well, I work for such and such, I mean, that's the first thing that comes out of your mouth. That's, that's that your identity is tied up with that business. And that's pretty interesting. I mean, it's, it should be like, I'm a dad, and I'm, and I do this, and I enjoy that and I work I, I solve these problems. And they've got nothing to do with a company's brand. It's just this is what I can do. And, you know, that that, that for me is like, we need to shift a little bit about knowing who who we are, rather than whose company you know, who we worked for. Yeah. And sorry to interrupt, but I mean, isn't part of your identity also what you do? I mean, like, if you're talking about a famous football, right, you don't just say like, well, I'm, I'm this guy, if I'm with the team, I do belong to a team. I'm, I'm, I'm the striker for this particular. I think, part of what I think is it is it is an issue sometimes as we all try to tear ourselves away from the rest of identity, when it is a significant parts of identity. I mean, you know, one is an advertising man, you know, I'm a presenter, I'm an MC, I can't run away that far from that particular, you know, idea. Then was, what your skills are, not who you work for. So for example, yeah, go ahead, go on. Sorry. Sorry, Tim, to intro. I think there's a difference between who you are and the reason you work for so This I think, Tim, I mean, what you said about, you know, when I work for CBP do right. And if anything happens, because I'm so attached to BPO. And I claim my my title there when the title has disappeared, I become just a creative person. I guess the most important thing is that as a creative person, what do you stand for? What do you believe? And why should people hire you again. So when I left JW T, and resigned to start my own company, I wanted to build a brand that I believed in, and then I got reemployed back to you know, BBDO is because of the things I reinvented myself. So you guys know, I did some vertical storytelling, right? And so people want to see you. So you have to reinvent and keep up with the times, you need to continue to do things that adds value. And that's why, you know, I feel that we we become valuable to the company. So whether we lose our jobs, or you know, or something happens, we can still stand firm. I think that's what I mean, the whole purpose of trying to regain your identity, that's really important. Yeah, absolutely. So we got about two minutes left with one, I'm wondering whether we should try to round up something with Guan before we move on to the next thing? Well, I was just gonna say one of the things that one mentioned was networking, which I think is absolutely critical. Like in the back there, which is, which is absolutely critical, because so joining professional associations that are linked to what you do, I think is a really important one. So we've all met through a professional association. And we're all we all come from different walks. But we we all understand within the context of that professional association, it gives us an identity that is beyond our work. Right. And I think that's that's another thing to invest in, whether it's the chambers of commerce or specific specific associations. What's what's in this others? What's an industry association for you one? The there's a marketing and advertising one? Yeah, I mean, there's, there's a few actually, if you don't mind, let's talk about the APSs. I think one thing is, for me to become a better creative person is to be able to present my ideas well, and to persuade clients to buy. So if I'm not joined, APSs, I've not I will not met you guys. I mean, so I mean, this is a very good testimonial about me going beyond my expert field, and try to learn and join association that will help to enhance my value. And it has, I mean, you won't realise this helped tremendously. I mean, I just presented in the pitch. And because of all the APSs learnings, it has helped me to improve in terms of persuading and getting clients to buy a lot of my creative work. Hmm, yeah, IPSs has been amazing. Like, if anyone, like a professional speaking Association, if you want persuasion, I think is a great one. But the ability to stand on stage and speak and get your point across, I think it's such a powerful skill for anyone. So wherever you are, get involved in certainly in something. Yeah. Correct. Correct. Because I think, you know, if we branded as a particular thing we might add, my second advice is, you know, be involved in a few things. So if you, if you happen to lose one identity, then you can, obviously, you know, focus on the other identity. So being the president is always a privilege, but as you know, it's a lot of hard work, but at the same time, with this whole process and term, I'm learning a lot too. And hopefully I'll be able to, you know, take that learning and become, you know, some I mean, to join an association. So I think the site hustle that we do is actually helping us to, you know, improve ourselves and to, you know, to learn all the different skills that will help us to be a more rounded person. So, the conclusion is Take responsibility for your life and your career. Yeah. Anyway, someone wrote in my name, then I don't know I think it was yeah, that was me. I don't know what to do that I can I can I can I can write anything. Anyway, apparently, we've still got 2025 minutes on your clock there. Guan. So do you want to? Do you want to? Do you want to jump out? Yes, I do. So much, has been a tremendous, tremendous pleasure to talk to you guys. And hope to do it again sometime soon. All right. Well, we'll see you in Singapore in a couple weeks. Remember? One? Yeah. I'm fired tomorrow. Okay, bye. Yep. Okay. All right. So the theme that we had was can we do good while doing well and we let's just give this a few min. That's because we've gone over. But there's an article in Foreign Policy. And I really recommend everyone to read this. And it says, Will Brazil destroy the Amazon to save the climate? So Brazil is basically underneath the Amazon rainforest is all of the precious metals that we need for a sustainable and renewable energy revolution. And, but if we destroy the Amazon, basically, we destroy the global climate. So once it turns into a savanna, the entire weather patterns of the world will will dramatically shift. And it's like, it's unbelievable. What will happen. But within the Amazon, obviously, the people who live there, the indigenous communities, but there's so many plants and animals that are going to have solutions to diseases that we that we're looking for answers for. So there's, there's just just the destroying the Amazon is not what we want to do. But we some of the scientists have said, we've already passed the tipping point. And it's, you know, it's going to escalate from here. So we're in a bit of a bind. And, you know, when it was, so what was his name Bolsonaro said, it was a policy of dig, baby dig, Lula's in the in the situation where he can't deny the opportunities for the country for the economy. But if it's uncontrolled, and of course, a lot of the early stuff is uncontrolled, it's very corrupt. You know, there's a lot of violence, a lot of social unrest. So the big players don't really want to get involved, because they don't like being involved there. But they're also recognising that, if they want to be part of the solution, they need to make sure that they take different steps. So did you both did you have a chance to read the article? Well, I can't. Yeah, I can't I got the gist of it, which essentially, essentially, it's one of those things where it's, it's like having your cake and eat it. So that situation, if you take a step back, there are many ways to look at it. It's a conundrum, right? It's, yeah, it's the thing that's going to save you is, is it's going to cost you a very expensive price. So what are you what are you going to what are you going to do? And what will you choose? I mean, I think the silicon Andrew actually kind of set up an opportunity for the entrepreneurs who are going to solve the problem, the way it should be solved. I mean, we should try to find a solution, which goes, how do we get at these precious resources without destroying the rain forests and the rest of the ecosystem? Is there a way of doing it? I mean, the problem is the law of unintended consequences means that something is going to happen that we just don't expect that someone's going to come up with an underground way of mining the whole thing, and cause something else to happen, right? I mean, fracking is a really good example of something like that, as in, it's supposed to do some things it was it was some kind of good, maybe just marketing. But it certainly turned out to be a far worse thing than just the co2 that comes off burning natural, natural gas, like earthquakes, right. You know, what? Yeah, I mean, but you look at the numbers. So the the World Bank estimates, we need 3 billion tonnes of strategic minerals by 2050. Brazil sits on 94% of the world's niobium. I asked my geotechnical engineering husband, if that was the correct explanation. And apparently it is 22% of all graphite matrix. Yeah, and 16% of known reserves of rare earth metals. So I mean, the numbers are huge. You know, because we need cobalt lithium. And we've already we've already reached peak cobalt. So I think that's a that's an important one is the nickel niobium and all the other critical ones. But when I got to the end of the article, another thing happened last week was one of the guys who heads up one of the big trucking companies in America spoke before Congress, he gave his perspective on the electric electrification of trucks. And what I'm feeling is happening now is a lot of these industries who have done bad, bad badly in the past, they are. And I'm not saying that I'm not putting the mining industry into this bracket yet, but like the trucking industry, they've shown wheeling, they've done what they can, they've done as much as they can. But the next stage requires billions, trillions of investment for us to be able to move forward or even a complete and utter revolution in how we do things. But when I read it, I felt like, Are we finally having the right level of conversation because it can't be your bad, we're good. It has to be. This is the collective path that we need to all go on. How do we get there? And what can we sacrifice to get there because we have to sacrifice something right. But can we say we can't sacrifice the Amazon? Right. So, you know, I think it's just that the conversations are have are happening. that have needed to happen for a really, really long time. I still think we're in the early days of those conversations, but I just feel like I'm seeing more and more of it. And like, you know, last year, there'd be two big announcements that mattered. Now we're having those big announcements and those big conversations almost every other day. So do you feel the escalation that's happening around really important conversations? I mean, it's great that that conversation is happening in the Congress level. Yeah. You know, at least there's least there's some that it's, it's not no show level, it's Congress level. But, you know, as you were saying, he was talking, it occurred to me, you know, maybe you mentioned brick earlier, Brazil, Russia, India, China. Well, last no show, we were talking about India, and their reliance on coal. And their, their requirement to, for that country to, to go to the next level is, is that amount of energy that it requires. Brazil is chopping down the rainforests to get it the minerals that it can export, to take it to country to the next level, Russia, it's doing its thing with Ukraine, and whatever it is, and today, we're talking about China, developed into a level of, of, you know, and weirdly enough thing is appointed all those four at the moment, whereas Russia has got massive forests as well. So it's it. And it's one of those things where if I was the guy running Brazil, trying to take care of the poor people in my country, and I need to chop down some trees to help them. Not that that's what he's doing, by the way. But I might just, I might just go, this is, I need to be able to do this to invest in the infrastructure to be able to take care of my country going forward. And why should I be forced to keep my rainforest? Because the rest of the world chopped down? There's, you know, I mean, it's a, it's, I know that that's a dumb argument in one sense, because you're gonna look at it from a global perspective. But this is where we've got, you know, we're pointing fingers at the family next door sort of thing. So it's only, it's only a dumb argument from the perspective of long term thinking versus short term gain, right? So keep your people happy in the short term, but basically destroy their future in the longer term. So it's just about playing. Nobody's paying? Nobody's paying for air. You know, if the if Brazil turns into a savanna, yeah, I don't, I don't really hold much to hope for the people of Brazil to survive in that climate. And we're heating up more and more, as we were talking about earlier, we've got to get things under control. And one of the most important things to keep it under control is the green stuff. We need more of that everywhere, you know. And so like, you know, I think this global conversation that just so required is good, go look at the big picture, what we got to save while we can't afford to lose. And then rather than working out, what we need to do to build this sustainable energy future, is how can we build a future? That's not the level itself? That's the thing, right? We can't replace what we have with renewable energy, we have to reduce what we have. And that's to me this is a conversation that I don't feel as being had you know, like every like that, you know, the Evie, Evie percentages, right, the gun off the roof, the amount of people who have ordered them bought them, which is great. But we need, you know, I was talking about it on climate courage. The other day, my friend Pete said, to share it, we need a sharing economy. So we don't all have a car, we have pools of electric vehicles in our communities that we will use and share and swap and yeah, and get around and you know, all that sort of stuff. And I think we're at the point if we want to be honest, like are the numbers that the World Bank and everybody else quoting? Are they to replace what we have? Or are they not? Are they are about you know, a level of energy requirement to to keep us all at a standard of life that's you know, where we can be warm where we can be cool, you know, all those sorts of things. But then fundamentally you got to change the whole goal of a country is GDP. It's is that make sustainable lifestyle thing as well? Right? I mean, we push as hard as we can as we can. I mean, if you think about how we used to live a long time ago, it be interesting to to come to a well, a sharing economy where instead of having a mobile phone, a personal mobile phone, you have face recognition, and a phone and that is always the Available in a room, and anybody who's there can check in every now and then and just use it occasionally for the things they need. I mean, just like the the phones of the old days, remember when we had a village, a village phone ran, I was thinking about this, I gave someone advice that they about relationships. And it's something that my mom said about how you can try to figure out things. And it was about doing a list of what you can live with, and what you can't live without. Right. And it just just I was just thinking about this in terms of how we've got to get people kind of on the same list because people can't live without certain things. But they can live without a lot of things. And because of that they compromise. And so they continue to do what they do. So people stay in bad relationships, because they can't live without x. And so they can live with with why, right, we need to be a little bit less tolerant, I feel that there's a need for there's a need for a less tolerant society. Not not saying that we should become rude to everybody. At the same time, I think we need to be able to figure out how to be less tolerant, more expressive, and yet more civil at the same time. I think if we have that kind of combination, then we'll be able to make some kind of progress. So what Praveen Gupta who was on climate coverage last week, and I did a podcast with Nisha Singh. And they were talking a lot about how the children, the younger people of India have basically been raised to believe in the American dream, right. And it was, it was a really insightful, sort of, for me, it was very insightful. It's like there's this whole generation, China, not so much because the media is controlled. But if you think of Asia as a whole, right, and you know, 63% of the world's population, obviously 1.4 Whatever billion people are, Chinese, but probably 2 billion are not Chinese, right? All of them raised with this idea of the American Dream, the consumer dream. And we I think we need to stop visualising another dream of, you know, the five C's or 60s in Singapore, or whatever the the local, you know, the living the dream in Australia, whatever the dream is, right? I think we need to redefine the dream, and work out ways to tell that story in every country locally, so it's relevant. Yeah, but it's not about it's not about stuff. It's not about replacing what we've got. It's not about continuously, you know, having a continuation of the existence that we already have, you know, talking about the the factories in Bangladesh, and the workers there. You know, the amount of fast fashion, you know, people get a delivery of fast fashion, it doesn't fit, they, they throw it out, it ends up in a landfill. And it's back up in the environment, it just just there's this fantastic video being circulated at the moment, a kilometre of plastic waste in this channel, where they're trying to get water to the rice fields, and it's a kilometre of waste. And basically, the water couldn't come through at a time when the I think there's about a 20% loss in rice production in this region, which we know will have dramatic implications in this region, because it's a, it's a core basic food for people. You know, so I think we've just yet so the it's time for us to elevate the conversation up to a much higher level. And I think I think it's starting, it's got to hurry up. But it's, it's global in nature. It's not it's not individual. And so what do we all need to do to get this, get this on track? And are we willing to sacrifice the Amazon to keep what we've got? Or are we finally going to grow up and go, Wow, this is an unsustainable lifestyle. Everybody needs to watch the Lorax Yeah. It's the big unless, so the the thing that I again, coming right down the middle there is this idea of I was talking to my to my to my kids about things don't have to be binary, we don't always have to say this is the it's going to be conclusion, a conclusion B. There is a way so I'm the person who believes very much that there is a way of doing good and doing well all at the same time, but it has to come by design, you can't just stop heading off in one direction and then thinking oh, you know, what I actually need to do is try and do this as well. You kind of have to design into the process. Like you know, we talked about capture carbon capture, vehicle design in the future, any kind of activity done in the future, I think should have automatically carbon capture design into it. So that it isn't a solution in itself, but it is also at the same time. You know, mindful of what what the environment what what the impact is to the environment and minimising it as well. So you know, there is there is a another path, I feel where it's not as great and not as absolute as what everyone maybe once. But it's a kind of slowing down the kind of adaptation kind of thing where we I mean, we talk about the eventualities of, of calamitous climate change. But there's also the factor that gives that time gives us right because, yes, three years with today's technology is not enough time. But is eight years with tomorrow's technology, enough time for us to figure something else out. The chemistry of batteries, for instance, I mean, you remember how when it first came out why electric cars weren't feasible is because the chemistry was all wrong. And then they figured out a new chemistry. And then we went, Okay, now we can do this. So the panels in the in the Start weren't exactly feasible, but we worked out a better way of doing it. And so they become feasible. Windmills as much as they've been around, you know, in the Netherlands, they've never had enough efficiency, enough power output to make it significant enough as a as a power. So until we keep improving on the technology and making it better and better. And then the Chinese stole it and did anyway. So there is this thing about time, if we can buy ourselves time, and we don't stay still. I think there's something that also is in that story, because I think, I think the idea that that there is no way except this way or that way. Sometimes really doesn't get us to a better place. Because all you have is a bunch of optimists and pessimists all on the same bus that's careening off the cliff, you know, a difference in opinion at a critical moment, when really what you could do perhaps is steer. Or another analogy is that they're at a fork in the road, and they can't see where we're both roads go to. So everyone's standing, still arguing about the best direction. But actually, we need to be, which is your windmill or your electric vehicle analogy as well. It's basically we need to be building the stuff to solve the problem, even though it's a little bit expensive now, because that will bring the technology to the point where it becomes feasible. But what I'm what I'm describing is, it's a bit different in terms of in terms of analogy, you know, we often talk about the fork in the road. We don't talk about the new road. That's what I think we need to consider as well isn't like there is this way, there is that way, but maybe there's another way the new road requires chopping down trees. Is the wrong interpretation of your analogy. But yeah, yeah. But yeah, it's innovation. I mean, maybe maybe maybe the metaverse can actually save everyone because we can buy a Louis Vuitton bag in the metaverse where it doesn't do any harm. It just exchanging money. Yeah, when when when it's too hot for us to be outside, we can at least be in the middle of showing off our Louis Vuitton. Right. Yeah. There's, there's so many angles I that the new road? Absolutely. And bringing the indigenous voices making sure it equality is sitting at the table making the decisions because women and children were most impacted. But it's about making sure all the right voices are at the table and like green technology, I've been looking at investments. And they're still going through the same cycle Syria series, a series B, sort of funding investments to build these businesses when we should be going, No, no, we need a different business model here. We need to say that's a technology like seaweed made out of plastic plus plastic made out of seaweed. It's, it's still not here, because they're still trying to make they're still trying to get money and investment to build a business. Well, sorry, the biggest plastic companies in the world should be sitting up, like research stations all over the world where they bring the brightest talent together. And if someone comes up with a great idea, they give them a lot of money, then they go and make it happen. And those geniuses that come up with the idea can get to get to work on the next idea. You know, we're just thinking if we could, it's a different business model. Yeah. But I mean, that comes down to who's running it and what their goals are, what they're being measured on. Because they're being measured on profitability, right. And, and the so look at look at people making plastic products, or products that require plastic casing, in the countries that are going this is ridiculous. They're removing the plastic and doing something else. But in those other countries that aren't complaining about it, they're still getting the plastic version from the same company. So just providing the appearance of a solution. And we all assume it's global, but it isn't, you know, yeah, if you go to those countries, you go, Oh my gosh, this is like, this is 20 years ago that we used to have this and they've still got it. So McDonald's got rid of the styrofoam packaging in Australia, and I was in India and China and other countries that were still there, right. Yeah. So. So there's this thing about about the new road and the new way and doing things right, you know, like, but the other big part of it is the challenge of scaling. So engineers have a big part to play as well. I remember reading about a car that was made entirely out of corn, you know, and I was just, I was just amazed that that was, what was possible, but maybe wait till the temperatures go up? Well, I mean, you know, they figure out different materials and stuff like that, but it's all up to do with with engineering of obviously wasn't going to be efficient at that point. But you know, it is always about them the scaling idea, because proof of concept you can use, we can right now, for instance, create gold, but it takes an entire mountains worth of a particle accelerator and the right conditions and everything, and we create one atom of gold. You know, if we can figure something out around there, maybe we can do something as well, you know, so it's always about, it's not just about what's possible, it's about scaling, it's about marketing, it's about getting it to the, to the to the audience, so that they feel it's opening often enough, you need to have and I think the world is getting to this point right now where we are hitting that chat GBT curve with the environment, because now it's becoming mainstream. Now a politician can get on stage and speak about something. And he knows that more people are going to be hearing about it, from a perspective of, of being on board, rather than what is this person talking about? So you know, it is it is unfortunately, the thing that takes time, it is the thing that needs to go from one person to the other. But I'll speak as someone who's been in the business of MLM some time ago, you think about MLM makes so much sense. And it shouldn't actually just work, you tell a friend, they tell a friend, everybody uses the same thing, and someone makes money from it. But it just doesn't work that way, because other things get in the way. And yet, sometimes the base idea is so simple, it should just make sense. So, you know, the care for the environment, doing the right thing, eating healthy, sleeping enough, all those things are just automatically known answers make sense things which we don't do. So something, something has to come into that you know that so that it becomes automatic, the the the real genius for, for getting people to do the right thing is to turn it into automatic behaviour. So we're going to try and figure out how we can make it automatic that someone does something and automatically does something good for the environment. Be one. Yeah, and that systemic change pace, you know, businesses have to change, governments have to lead it, you know, because individual change, unless it scales up into the billions isn't going to isn't going to get us out of it. So yeah, it's a big complicated thing. But it but as far as my conclusion from this piece, and some and a lot of stuff, our meaning is try not to get stuck in Doom or despair. Because it's very difficult not to go there, when you first start sort of really coming to terms with the scale of the issue that we're facing. But if you need to be there, you need to be there. Just try not to get stuck there. And then when you're ready to come out, that's, you know, there's, I sort of believe we're at the point, now we've got to try and do everything we can possibly do to turn it around, and we might fail. You know, we might have left it too late. But I would rather live in a world where we're, we're coming together and trying our best to succeed. Then following the current dystopian paths that were run, which I think is going to send us into a very, very dark place for you, for all of us, wherever we are, wherever we live in the world. You know, because we've got mass migration, you know, the temperatures I was talking about with wet bulb temperatures, that's evacuating the tropics, the equatorial sort of region of the world. If we keep letting it get too hot, they will it will have to be evacuated. You know, where, where will those people be able to go? Who will welcome them in? You know, right, based on what we're seeing, so, but I think I feel that there's a shift and that's it. That's a good thing. I've been waiting for it for a long time. So yeah, keep the face. All right. What do you what's keeping you distracted? Well, I'm going to start off by giving you two recommendations. One is to save you time and one is for you to go and find something that may cause you to have a nice emotional reaction and it is The first of all the positive one which is the movie is called linoleum. It stars Jim Gaffigan who is better known for being a sarcastic comedian in the US, but it really is quite a nice film. I don't want to do too much whether because it'll it'll just spoil it for you. But if you're looking for something that delivers a nice human experience and for a strange reason will leave you feeling all emotional. linoleum is that film is it's what it falls in the category of slightly antsy, so I'll just give you that that caveat, but it's worthwhile looking out for linoleum starring Jim Gaffigan. The other recommendation is for you not to watch the highly promoted apple plus movie ghosted, like the title the movie to should be missed. Wow, there's the review. Why not? Not very intriguing as far as the movies concerned? I mean, it's it's well known stars, but it's not. There is no real development in terms of the story. You know, I sat down with my wife to watch it and both of us after a while we're looking each other going like Shall we shall we? Shall we bail out now? Should we bail out now? Should we be allowed now? She bailed out and I stayed with it after a while. But it was it was just one of those things as a premise, a really nice idea for a story, but as a story, just not well told. So save yourself some time. It's not worth the trouble, even though it is number three on the Apple TV plus charts. Number. It just reminded me I watched something the other day and it was kind of period drama is five woman's Oh, yeah. Steven Spielberg one. Copy that one. It can't be that one. Because it wasn't. So that was that was a recommendation I gave you some some weeks ago. My story. It was a period drama. We sort of had a sort of that English sort of whatever that series was. Anyway, I watched it. It was a common thing. Yeah, yeah. And it was so bad. It was so unfunny. It was Mr. Something. I'm just trying to. I'm just on the voice. Yeah. Giving negative recommendations on this show. No, no, no. She said, It's not the fable months. Now. It's about the fable. Because I actually want to watch that. There was a lot of things about the fable minutes. Yeah. And so the other thing that I've been watching. So first of all, if you haven't watched it, what she said, have you guys watched that yet? which one she said, she said, which is the story of the you know, what's his name? Harvey Weinstein. Absolutely fantastic. Like on so many levels. It's fantastic. It's such a powerful movie. And Steve watched it. And he was really, really blown away by it, watching it as a man. There was so many there's so many aspects to it that I, you know, like these two incredible women, female journalists who went after the story, but it's so the story of their marriage. And for the first time, it was like these two ambitious, dedicated women, their marriages didn't fall apart because they were out there pursuing their dreams or husbands was supportive. It was all sorts of things like that. So it was really incredible. But the other thing that I'm really enjoying and I just sit there for 30 minutes or 40 minutes with a smile on my face is the new season of Ted law so it's so beautiful don't say anything though. I mean, I don't mean downloading I love it. It's so good. That the episode where they were partying in Amsterdam, probably the best one No, no no it's I'm not giving anything away it's probably the best the best I have a party okay don't say anything yet so when it came out I was very excited but I can't do the watch an episode and wait a whole week so I I ignore it for a while it banks up I finished my assignments and then I binge. Yeah, you'll be you'll be ready for a binge in about three weeks time. So Episode Seven has just been released. I think it's 1010. Preseason. That's good. Yep. Yep. All right table. I got two weeks to go. So when I start my binge, it'll work out just about right when the final episode drops. Yeah, yeah, that's fun. Hey. You're not being distracted by anything at the moment right apart from work? No, me? No, no studies. I just Ecclesiastes was the latest one. Meaningless. It's all meaningless. All right. All right, guys. We're gonna say goodbye. Thank you so much for joining us. I hope you enjoyed and got something out of it. Guys, any final words? Well, I've been thinking about something which I I have used in my personal life almost every single day, which I think I want to translate into something for everyone else to use. It's when I'm on the road in Singapore, and I find someone, someone doesn't signal someone doesn't give room and someone doesn't do something. And people get involved with this thing of blasting the horn or high beams and stuff like that. It's all about scolding and whatever, right. And what I do is I try not to do any of that. And I have this policy, which is very simple, just drive, just drive, you know, get to the next place, move, whatever it is. So that means that whenever there's something blocking your way, just steer yourself out of the way. Just get around it, whatever it is, because all the energy you spend on that other stuff really doesn't make a difference at all. So, you know, for driving, that's the case. My wife in her wisdom, pointed out that I'm very good. We're doing that in the car, but not so much in real life. So I am now adapting that idea to just driving and just trying to figure out where it is we're trying to go. And as things happen that just fear rather than get held up in traffic. Nice. I like it. Glaring it is my one I'm suggesting. And why are you following? Yeah, so Galera T dot app. And what that is, is you add it to your it'll give you summaries. So we can do a summary of the no show as it because it's on YouTube, right. And this will give it a summary and give you ideas and tips about what's been actually said on the show. So go check it out. Clarity dot app. I've got to tell you guys every time you share something from AppSumo with me like you did last week is not good. But you shared and AppSumo thing I downloaded it didn't work ridiculous. Got the money back from AppSumo. Just like I'm being emailed, bombarded by all these new platforms yet, so both of you have done it to me. Anyway. Avoid it. Alright guys, I'm gonna say goodbye when sitting there. Yeah. Oh, well, we'll be we'll be we'll be back in a month because we're all going to be sort of gathering for a big annual conference, you know, convention in Singapore in a couple of weeks. So we'll be back in a month and we look forward to seeing you there. Alright, see you guys. Bye. Okay, I'll do it.